ESUN flexible filament (updated PVA results)

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livingstereo1991
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:39 am

ESUN flexible filament (updated PVA results)

Post by livingstereo1991 »

Hello All, Felix 3.0 Dual user here in Hong Kong!

So far the results from PLA have been pretty good and I am looking forward to move onto dual head printing pretty soon.

I just purchased a new flexible filament with the brand Esun but I have encountered a few problems, so I'm wondering whether any users here can share their experience of using this filament or other flexible materials?

I can't seem to get the filament extrude well. I tried different temperatures ranging from 195-220c, different extruder tension settings, but it seems like it clogs when it reaches the nozzel and the extrusion will slip as a result. I tried to tension the extruder further but it doesnt seem to help the issue, instead the filament will be flattened too much and gets tangled before it reaches the hotend (I did pull it out successfully). I have to note that the filament does come out when I apply some force on the filament feed, just not on its own.

Regards,
Angus
Last edited by livingstereo1991 on Mon Aug 18, 2014 5:02 am, edited 1 time in total.

Legion 2.3
Posts: 84
Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2014 6:23 pm

Post by Legion 2.3 »

Hi livingstereo

I´ve encountered this problem a while ago with colorfabb pla/pha-filament which is a bit softer, too.

There are 2 tricks that may help:

- Canola oil
Rub a bit of canola oil at the first few cm of your filament. The oil will rest inside the nozzle and provides less friction.

- More power to the fan!
The hot-end-fan is supplied with only 5 V from the board. You can easily increase it´s power by wiring it to 12 V (direct from the power supply). The cool part of the hor end stays cooler, the entering filament stays harder for a longer time and you get even less friction.

Good luck :)

livingstereo1991
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:39 am

Post by livingstereo1991 »

Thanks Legion !

Will keep you posted on the results :)

Speaking of dual head printing, would you recommend purchasing the pro-license for Kisslicer ? Or is there any better options out there? I stumble upon Simplify3D the other day, looks like a very friendly designed interface but the price is subsequently higher too.

Dreide
Posts: 176
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 12:32 am
Location: Lausanne, Switzerland

Post by Dreide »

Legion 2.3 wrote:- More power to the fan!
The hot-end-fan is supplied with only 5 V from the board. You can easily increase it´s power by wiring it to 12 V (direct from the power supply).
I think for the 3.0dual the fan is already connected to 12V which does make sense as there is only one fan for two extruders.

In my experience, low enough idler tension and a low printing speed are key for successfully printing the soft stuff. Idler tension should be low enough for the extruder wheel to slip through just before the filament starts buckling, because if it buckles you have lost. Then, the printing speed has to be low enough for the extruder wheel not to slip (at least not by too much). With FilaFlex I have to go as low as 10mm/s. How much force is needed to push the filament through not only depends on the friction created within the extruder but also on the back pressure coming from the nozzle while extruding. Pushing filament down to a potentially too close print bed while doing a solid infill leaves the extruded material much less room to evade than, for example, purging filament into free air. Nevertheless, the normally used extrusion speed for purging filament while getting the print started might already be too much for soft filament. As an example, with a layer height of 0.2mm and an extrusion width of 0.4mm, 10mm/s printing speed translates to 10mm/s·0.2mm·0.4mm/(pi·(1.75mm/2)^2)=0.33mm/s filament intake speed (what is called extrusion speed in Repetier host).
BTW, at least some of the soft filaments are sensitive to moisture. The FilaFlex, which I stored for just a few months in a sealed plastic bag with some Silica gel, is currently not printable because of all the moisture in it. So before I can use it again, I have to put it in the oven I guess.
Felix 2.0->3.0dual * Repetier (host+firmware) * KISSlicer Pro, Simplify3D * Cubify Design

viljmak52
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:07 pm

Post by viljmak52 »

You have to have KISslicer Pro before you can use it for two extruder. I have both, Simplify3D and KISslicer Pro and I prefer KISslicer. It has many properties that help working with two extruder.
Most materials are very sensitive for humidity, I had to make dry box (air tight box and plenty of silica gel) for filaments before I got PVA and Nylon work properly.
livingstereo1991 wrote:Thanks Legion !

Will keep you posted on the results :)

Speaking of dual head printing, would you recommend purchasing the pro-license for Kisslicer ? Or is there any better options out there? I stumble upon Simplify3D the other day, looks like a very friendly designed interface but the price is subsequently higher too.

livingstereo1991
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue Jan 28, 2014 3:39 am

Post by livingstereo1991 »

So got kisslicer pro for a few days already and I tested some dual head printing over the weekend. I briefly forgotten the flexi material for a moment and went on to try another material that I bought - the Esun PVA soluble material.
Strings, strings everywhere
Strings, strings everywhere
Messy and stringy
Messy and stringy
As you can see, the prints are stringy, possibly due to a higher temperature and not enough "suck". The first print ended with my PVA hotend clogging. I spotted a decrease flow from the hotend around 30 minutes followed by excess filament creeping out the cold side of the hotend.
How the end of the filament looks when I pull it out, luckily no further clog
How the end of the filament looks when I pull it out, luckily no further clog
This is how it looks after I pulled the filament from the hotend, looks like the hotend has melted into a pva puddle, with a few bubbles inside too.
WP_20140818_10_14_37_Pro.jpg
First and second trial comparison. In the second trial I have reduced the temperature and speed, at the same time increasing the suck value. You can see from the much cleaner outlook of the object. Their height represents the time when the pva started clogging, the second one lasted a bit longer but still clogged in the end (around 30-40 minutes after commencing).

Im going to share my latest setting here.
PLA.jpg
PVA.jpg
style.jpg
Angus

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