ABS not warping with hairspray. well. sort of

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Hugues
Posts: 270
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:36 pm

ABS not warping with hairspray. well. sort of

Post by Hugues »

hi guys,

i was writing recently into a separate thread about the issues i had with warping parts using ABS. I tried acetone glue and tonight white glue, but no luck.

So after reading about it elsewhere i decided to try the hairspray method: it works ! well, at least for now. My set-up:

- ABS i bought recently at http://www.fabberworld.com (i'm not affiliated with them ;) )
- glass plate, 2mm thick, cleaned with pure acetone first , don't know if it's important
- then applied 3 short shots of the hairspray shown in picture below, seems to be manufactured in Switzerland, a bit expensive (according to my wife oups) maybe you can find something similar looking at the main ingredients
- extruding at 240, bed temp between 80-90
- no bottom fan, don't know if this is important
- the warp test part is 5 x 40 mm, by 10 mm high, so a bit demanding in terms of warping, i think
- sliced with SFACT at 0.2mm, no raft, no brim , no nothing
- feed 90%, flow 60%, but not sure this affects the warping either

The part is surprisingly easy to remove right after the finish, it leaves a slight white trace on the glass, don't know yet if it's better to spray some more before the second part, probably. The part came out at 4.95 x 40.12 x 9.94mm -> this can probably be fine tuned i presume playing with some parameters of SFACT, but is precise enough for what i need so far.

So tomorrow i'll try to print the larger part that was giving me problem over the week-end, and i'll keep you posted.
spray1.jpg
spray2.jpg
Last edited by Hugues on Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Hugues
Regards from Switzerland

buchie
Posts: 3
Joined: Thu May 02, 2013 9:14 pm

Post by buchie »

cheers for the tip,

I'm already pissing myself at the thought of buying an expensive hairspray while I'm bold :lol:

Thanks

Michel

Hugues
Posts: 270
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:36 pm

Post by Hugues »

update tonight:

-printing a larger part
- did not clean the glass nor remove the spray residue of last night
- a little warping at one end I'm afraid
- possible reasons: too much spray ? not enough spray ? possible greasy layer on glass ?

I will print the same part tomorrow but before i will clean the glass completely with acetone and put a new thin layer of spray.
Hugues
Regards from Switzerland

superhornet59
Posts: 60
Joined: Wed Apr 03, 2013 1:58 am

Post by superhornet59 »

Glad to hear about your success Hugues!

Hugues
Posts: 270
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:36 pm

Post by Hugues »

Printing a part that used to give me headache due to warping,
now no more warping with hairspray and brim

ABS 240/90c

http://youtu.be/XD_DJXVBEIw
Hugues
Regards from Switzerland

Hugues
Posts: 270
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:36 pm

Post by Hugues »

well, heck, ABS is hard headed ! :evil:

I've got warping now developing on my part, even with hairspray and brim. :shock:

Well, we'll sleep on this and think it over....

...maybe i should try lowering the bed temp, who knows....or try the water+sugar mix....or the vodka. Probably better to drink that one at the moment. LOL.
Hugues
Regards from Switzerland

satoer
Posts: 436
Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2012 8:00 pm
Location: Netherlands

Post by satoer »

Sand the glass plate.
My Felix 1.5 printed designs on Thingiverse
E3D V6 Hot end upgrade for your Felix
Tweezer bracket for your Felix
Led bar upgrade for your Felix

Lioric
Posts: 116
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 1:13 am

Post by Lioric »

Huges, don't fight it, just put mice ears (few layers thick, a big disc if needed, and tape them down as well if extra needed) and print it

Or if you want the best, just use ABS glue (the kind that is available at home depot), that thing is extra strong. I use a "multi purspose cement" abs and pvc glue, and I seriously think that there is no way that a part can lift with that thing (I use an extra layer of plastic on top of the bed so I can detach the part easily without tearing apart the printer ;) )

hoolito
Posts: 95
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2013 7:15 pm

Post by hoolito »

Hi Hugues,

Actually, you will have different shrinking behaviours with different geometries, so some parts will be easier to hold for the adhesive layer (whichever it is)
Apparently, the higher processing temperature of the ABS just makes this problem more delicate than PLA.
Unfortunately, if you want to "understand" more, I don't know if there is much workaround than digging a little into plastic processing handbooks (chapters that explain volumetric shrinkage).

I just got my new printer working right with PLA (Kapton+Acetone+Leveling are key!), so I want to enjoy the peace a little before starting experimenting with ABS... But at first sight it could be good to design your part so that bottom layers remain always stiff enough to endure the shrinking force of the ones coming on top of them.
This guy explains it a little: http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=Yhf ... =endscreen
(A pity that the video is a book example of making a 1-minute video in 7! :-)

Just like there are design rules for designing parts for injection molding, we should be making them for Home FDM also...

Cheers and good luck!
Felix 2.0

Hugues
Posts: 270
Joined: Thu Apr 04, 2013 5:36 pm

Post by Hugues »

Interesting idea for sure. Thanks.
Not always easy though to add these big holes on some parts.
I'm currently designing an air intake for my electric bike and I can't think of a way to add these holes .

But if his theory is correct (not having continuous "lanes" of ABS), there might be other ways of achieving this at a smaller scale. I could imagine a slicer doing this actually.

Anyone around with slicer programming skills ?
Hugues
Regards from Switzerland

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